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Re: [patch/rfc] Remove all setup_xfail's from testsuite/gdb.mi/

Once again, I feel the need to apologize for my tone.  I'm being too
sensitive about this.  Sorry... let's try this again.

On Thu, Jan 16, 2003 at 02:02:50PM -0500, Andrew Cagney wrote:
> >I don't think making it a requirement that go out and analyze all the
> >existing XFAILs is reasonable, although it is patently something we
> >need to do.  That's not the same as ripping them out and introducing
> >failures in the test results without addressing those failures.
> >>As a specific example, the i386 has an apparently low failure rate. 
> >>That rate is badly misleading and the real number of failures is much 
> >>higher :-(  It's just that those failures have been [intentionally] 
> >>camoflaged using xfail.  It would be unfortunate if people, for the 
> >>i386, tried to use that false result (almost zero fails) when initally 
> >>setting the bar.
> >
> >
> >Have you reviewed the list of XFAILs?  None of them are related to the
> >i386.  One, in signals.exp, is either related to GDB's handling of
> >signals or to a longstanding limitation in most operating system
> >kernels, depending how you look at it.  The rest are pretty much
> >platform independent.
> I've been through the files and looked at the actual xfail markings. 
> They are dominated by what look like cpu specific cases (rs6000 and HP 
> are especially bad at this).

Most of these which are *-*-* are actually generic, even when they have
HP markings, in my experience.

> I've also noticed cases where simply hanking the xfail doesn't make 
> sense - when the failure has already been analized (easy to spot since 
> they are conditional on the debug info or compiler version).

Definitely.  On the other hand, the particular choice of xfail
conditions is often really bogus.

> >>This is also why I think the xfail's should simply be yanked.  It acts 
> >>as a one time reset of gdb's test results, restoring them to their true 
> >>values.   While this may cause the bar to start out lower than some 
> >>would like,  I think that is far better and far more realistic than 
> >>trying to start with a bar falsely set too high.
> >
> >
> >This is a _regression_ testsuite.  I've been trying for months to get
> >it down to zero failures without compromising its integrity, and I've
> >just about done it for one target, by judicious use of KFAILs (and
> >fixing bugs!).  The existing XFAILs all look to me like either
> >legitimate XFAILs or things that should be KFAILed.  If you're going
> >to rip up my test results, please sort them accordingly first.
> No one is ripping up your individual and personal test results.
> Several years ago some maintainers were intentionally xfailing many of 
> the bugs that they had no intention of fixing.  That was wrong, and that 
> needs to be fixed.
> An unfortunate consequence of that action is that the zero you've been 
> shooting for is really only a local minimum.  The real zero is further 
> out, that zero was a mirage :-(

Close, close... what I'm trying to avoid is a local minimum.  The zero
I've been shooting for should be a local _plateau_.  Then we continue
going down as XFAIL/KFAILs are fixed/analyzed/recategorized/everything
else that happens to bugs when they go to bug heaven.

> >It doesn't need to be done all at once.  We can put markers in .exp
> >files saying "xfails audited".  But I think that we should audit
> >individual files, not yank madly.
> (which reminds me, the existing xfail reference to bug reports need to 
> be ripped out - they refer to Red Hat and HP bug databases :-().


> > If
> >you introduce seventy failures, then that's another couple of weeks I
> >can't just look at the results, see "oh, two failures in threads and
> >that's it, I didn't break anything".
> People doing proper test analysis should be comparing the summary files 
> and not the final numbers.  A summary analysis would show 70 XFAIL->FAIL 
> changes, but no real regressions.

I do, but it's exceedingly convenient for, e.g., automated testing
purposes to have the actual number of FAILs come out as zero and each
bug to be otherwise accounted for.  What I would like to do is get to
that point, and then recategorize directly from:
  random XFAIL->analyzed XFAIL
etc. on a case-by-case basis.  I don't see any benefit from ripping out
the XFAILs wholesale and then analyzing them as we find the time; why
not (rip out and analyze) as we find the time?

> Anyway,
> If the eixsting (bogus) xfail PR numbers are _all_ ripped out, and then 
> the requirement for all new xfail's to include a corresponding bug 
> report, I think there is a way forward.

This I definitely like.  "Cantfix"?

Daniel Jacobowitz
MontaVista Software                         Debian GNU/Linux Developer

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