Re: Default Mouse Pointer is Wrong

["Cary Jamison" <Cary dot Jamison at powerquest dot com>]

"Harold L Hunt II" <huntharo@msu.edu> wrote in message
news:<3FA96216.70706@msu.edu>...
> Cary Jamison wrote:
> 
> > I've noticed this too, but haven't complained about it.  I didn't
> > realize the problem was specific to the -multiwindow window manager.
> 
> This isn't a problem.  It is "the way it works".
> 
> > If this is true, than -multiwindow is not behaving as expected nor
as
> > other window managers behave wrt default cursors.  The xsetroot is a
> > work-around, but it seems to me this should be regarded as a bug in
the
> > window manager.  The 'X' should be the default cursor when over the
root
> > window but an arrow when over an application window.  Since
-multiwindow
> > doesn't really have a visible root window, it seems like permanently
> > changing the default cursor to a pointer would be a good/quick
solution.
> 
> Fine.  Run 'twm' as your window manager.  Doesn't it do the same exact

> thing?  That is the way that I have been reading the emails... if that

> is not the case, then could somebody please describe this better.?

No, it behaves as I described earlier.  Let me try again.

There is an 'X' over the root window, but when over an application
window the X changes to an arrow.  I realize that an application may
define its own pointers, but when it doesn't -multiwindows goes back to
an 'X' and twm goes to a black arrow.

For example :
  XWin&
  twm&
  xclock&

When the pointer is over the clock, it is a black arrow.  When over the
background it is an 'X'.

  XWin -multiwindow&
  xclock&

When the pointer is over the clock it is an 'X'.  There is no background
window.  I notice this in other apps as well.  For example, on the
scroll-bar of a gnome-terminal window displayed from my Linux box.  This
is where it gets annoying, because you have to point with the center of
the X instead of the tip of an arrow.

So, in essence most window managers have two default pointers - one when
over an app and one when over the background.  (Perhaps the window
manager only has one default pointer and uses the X server's default
pointer when not over a managed window?)

>From the history of XWin it is easy to see that there was originally
only a need for one default pointer.  When the internal window manager
got added, it still only has one pointer.  However, since there is no
background root window having one pointer is sufficient since it can be
the app default pointer (an arrow) instead of the background default
pointer (an X).

> The solution you propose is not trivial.  That is why this is "the way

> it works" and not a bug.  I'm sure that upon further inspection you 
> would figure out that trying to change this policy would result in the

> creation of a mouse-cursor over-riding policy that is a lot more 
> complicated than what you think it would be.  I'm pretty sure that it 
> would be complicated enough that it isn't worth looking into.  Of 
> course, feel free to code me into submission.

You may be right, since I haven't looked at the code yet.  The default
should be changeable through resource files, etc., so to do it right may
not be as simple as adding a line of code in the internal window manager
to change it.  Does the internal window manager handle any resources at
all, yet?  There probably hasn't been a need to define any.

The workaround of setting it in the startup file isn't bad, but it would
be nice to get it changed right for the newbies, etc.  Maybe as a
minimum the xsetroot command could be added with appropriate comments to
the startup file.

Here's even a psuedo-diff for you :-)

    <append to startxwin.bat>
    + REM Set default cursor - normally only useful with -multiwindow
window manager
    + run xsetroot -cursor_name left_ptr -fg white -bg black

I'm not making any promises, but my work-load should lighten up in a
couple weeks and I may be able to have a look at this then.

> Harold

Cary